You have to want it

There are simply going to be interviews where you’re completely outmatched and on the verge of defeat. Interviewing is a tough process no matter how hard you prepare for it. Here I share the advice that no interview is lost, no matter how difficult, while you still have the passion, energy, purpose, and frame of mind to fight through it, turning a losing battle into a fighting chance.

Here I share an excerpt from Chapter 13 of Interview Poker, where I talk about the importance of putting everything you have into your interview performance, of completely taking advantage of the opportunity in front of you, in the full style of carpe diem. This section is entitled, “Never give up.”

There are simply going to be interviews where you’re completely outmatched and on the verge of defeat. Interviewing is a tough process no matter how hard you prepare for it. Here I share the advice that no interview is lost, no matter how difficult, while you still have the passion, energy, purpose, and frame of mind to fight through it, turning a losing battle into a fighting chance. Please enjoy,

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”..Never give up

As we explained above, when you desire something hard enough, when failure is not an option, you won’t give up. You’ll go down in a blaze of glory before you give up. They’ll be talking about your interview for ages, before you give up. Stories of my interviews are even written in other people’s books. That’s how badly I want it. That’s how badly you need to want it to succeed.

I’ve approached interviews this way, where failure is not an option. If I don’t know the answer to something, I’m passionate about finding out what the answer is. I want to crack the puzzle. I’ll tell them I’m not sure yet, but I’ll invent something. If it’s really not going well, after 10 minutes or so, I’ll ask the interviewer for hints, tell them how I’m stuck, and how I think I can get unstuck. By this point I will have tried a brute force solution already if I can think of one. But if I get truly stuck, I’ll ask for their help. I’ll see what they’ll give me.

Until that dreaded email lands, you need to fight for every inch of ground you can win..

Some people may lead you to believe that the point at which you start asking for help, you’ve already failed the interview. In my opinion, and in my experience, you’re never out until that rejection notice comes. You need to treat it like you’re going to get the offer, no matter how badly the interviews go. Until that dreaded email lands, you need to fight for every inch of ground you can win.

The desire to succeed erases any fear of failure, and a sort of clarity emerges

That doesn’t mean being aggressive or disrespectful with the interviewer. It means trying to answer with every fiber of your being, it means tearing that answer out of places that you didn’t know answers could come from. It means being passionate. It sometimes means taking control. This is what desperation feels like. This is why they say necessity is the mother of all invention. I’ve had some of the most brilliant insights in moments like this. The desire to succeed erases any fear of failure, and a sort of clarity emerges. It’s somewhat like a runner’s high.

But as we said before, you have to want it. This has to be a place you really want to work for. I’ve never been able to get an offer at a place where this hasn’t been true. Many will tell you that they can walk in and get an offer anywhere, whether or not they really want it, with little to no prep. That may be true for some, or they may simply be boasting. If that represents you, I’m thrilled for you. I’d love to read your book sometime. For me, I have to work hard for the things I have, for the small victories that I get. It may very well represent most of the people who decide to pick up this book.

The implication of this is there will be times in the interview when your interviewer tries to take control. If they are legitimately trying to help you, let them. If they keep repeating the same information, not helping you, then take control of the situation. Start solving it in your own way, on your own terms. Force that hint to come if it’s going to. Honestly, at that point they’ve already made up their mind about you, and this is a no hire for them, so you need to turn the situation around; you need to fight to change them to a “maybe.”

Offers aren’t always made from the interviews you really nail

Offers aren’t always made from the interviews you really nail. Chances are you’re going to get 1, maybe 2 of those on average, if you prepare hard enough. The fact that you’ve made it as far as you have, past the phone-screen, shows that you’re capable of getting at least one. But instead, offers are made from turning losing battles into fighting chances. Real offers come from packets with a lot of “I’m not sure” grey area votes, and that 1 or 2 really passionate people speaking out for you. So you nail one of them as best as you can, and you fight like hell to turn the rest into at least a maybe. Then the offers will come. But you never leave anything on the table. You fight for every interview with all you can, no matter how badly you’re doing, no matter how lost things seem, no matter how badly you piss the guy off by trying your best even when things are lost.

I’ve told the interviewer before after he went through his tirade of repeating the same hint over and over, demanding that I come up with an algorithm first for a problem that had a really complex solution that I couldn’t derive the entire answer to from first principles, “You know, this one’s really unclear to me, so I’m going to try a different strategy. I’m not going to explain the algorithm to you first, I’m going to start writing code, playing with the data, and see if I can come up with one. I don’t really know the algorithm, so I’m going to invent one. If I get close enough to the answer, we can work together on it.”

I’m closer to a hire vote with working code and hurt feelings, than I am with someone who thinks I’m a nice guy, with no working code

Pretty soon, he saw the approach I was doing, saw that it was in the neighborhood of the solution he was trying to guide me to, and he started helping me. I turned him to my side. I wasn’t rude about it, but I told him I was going to try something different. I was direct. I’m sure there will be a red flag or two in that packet. But even if he’s mad at me, I’m closer to a hire vote with working code and hurt feelings, than I am with someone who thinks I’m a nice guy, with no working code. To get to that point, sometimes that means going against what the interviewer wants you to do, and doing things your own way. This shouldn’t be a first resort, by any means, but it also shouldn’t be a last resort.

..you won’t get many of these chances in your career, on average. So it’s something you need to protect and fight for.

Sometimes that goes really badly for you. You probably weren’t going to get that offer anyways. Sometimes it goes really good for you as well, if you can turn a losing round into a chance, breaking away from the rigid structure of the interview. Either way, it means not giving up, ever. It means standing up to bullies. It means protecting and fighting for what you have. Even an on-site round is something that belongs to you, something that you’ve earned; you won’t get many of these chances in your career, on average. So it’s something you need to protect and fight for.

In fact, I had a candidate do this to me once when I was at Apple, on a phone screen. This person had really messed up the interview and it was clear to me they had some serious weaknesses in their understanding of recursion and algorithm analysis. It was going to be a no hire vote from me for sure. Instead, they picked up on the way the interview was going, felt it was going to be a no answer, and they challenged me to give them another chance on another problem, that they were good but didn’t get to show it. I felt badly, that this was maybe just a fault of the question I asked them. Was I being too hard? I gave them a chance, and asked for a second phone screen for them with a colleague. The second screen rejected them as well a few days later, unfortunately. But they stayed in the game for one more round. They didn’t give up. They managed to change my mind out of sheer passion of will.

This whole game we play is one of numbers and luck, so the longer you’re in it, the more chances you have; remember that.

The point is though, the candidate turned a losing battle into a fighting chance. Even if they were defeated in the next round, they still survived one more round to fight again. What if they had gotten another co-worker of mine who had an easier question? Then they would have survived to a third round. By then they could have practiced enough to get an offer, perhaps; or they could have used it as interview prep for the next company that asked them enough questions they recognized, to then get the offer. This whole game we play is one of numbers and luck, so the longer you’re in it, the more chances you have; remember that.

This isn’t a game of finding who among us is really smart..

This isn’t a game of finding who among us is really smart, as proven by the interview outcome; interviews don’t work that way. Most people who make it that far into the process are smart enough and capable enough to do the job. This is a game of proving who can survive long enough to get the offer, of drawing a lucky hand, of sometimes having to bluff your way through when you don’t have the cards, because you can’t win every hand. This is interview poker.

That’s the way I’d like you to think about this process. Survive to the next round. Even rounds you’re not doing well, turn them to your favor. Even if you don’t think you’ll get the offer, do everything you can to convince them to give you another chance, of trying again, of getting to that next round. And do everything you can to prepare for that next round so that the opportunity is not wasted. It could just be the practice you need to get you the real offer, with some other company. I have no qualms about using an interview round just for practice, so long as I try everything in the fiber of my being to get myself an offer at that place--to really want it, to give my true best in that interview. This is what it takes to get hired nowadays. Otherwise, you’re just wasting their time, and wasting the incredible chance you’ve been given to succeed.

Give them reasons--reasons to want you back. Give them a reason to hire you. Fight for it. Never give up..”

Unpublished work. ? Copyright 2021, Joseph Johnson Jr.