From self-critical to self-compassionate: A conversation with Dr. Ellen Choi (Part 2 of 7)

You can listen to the complete podcast interview here: https://bit.ly/DrEllenPodcast.

This Q&A was adapted from my podcast conversation with Dr. Ellen Choi who is the founder of Mindfulness in the Workplace. Dr. Ellen graduated from Queen’s University Commerce before pursuing a master of science from the London School of Economics and ultimately completing a PhD from the Ivy School of Business. Her research interests revolve around the effects of mindfulness training on attention and emotional regulation, authenticity, resilience, errors and performance under pressure. Prior to graduate school, Ellen traded in commercial real estate for eight years. She has also been a yoga instructor and practices as an executive meditation coach. Dr. Ellen is a fascinating individual with vast amounts of knowledge who has been a wonderful resource in my life and work. 

Dr. Greg Wells: In your research, what have you discovered about being able to make the shift from being self-critical to self-compassionate? I ask because a number of people I've interviewed for this show have admitted, or sort of opened up to the fact, that they're very hard on themselves. I'm brutal on myself. So, to some extent, I'm asking this because it's a Greg therapy session, but I would love your insights into how your research showed that you can make that shift, and were there any factors that enabled people to do that a little bit better?

Dr. Ellen Choi: That’s such a beautiful question. This is the life's work. Being self-compassionate is incredibly complicated, and it's a really deep self-exploration.

When we talk about the default mode of processing in our brain, we know that there are three qualities. The first is that it's not in the present, so we're sort of future or past oriented – not really here in the moment. The second thing is that we are typically always thinking about ourselves, and it's not to say that we're selfish, just that, again, we are worried about “what do people think of me, what am I going to have for lunch, who do I need to call back,” etc. It's self-oriented. The last is that it's highly critical. When you put those three things together, functioning in a default mode makes it very difficult to be self-compassionate.

GW: So, you're not in the present, you're self-oriented and you're very critical?

EC: Yeah, absolutely. If that's the case, think what happens when an error shows up, or something tough happens. If you're in your default mode, then of course you're going to be attacking yourself. You're either thinking, “gosh, what are the consequences for the future?” or you're reliving and ruminating on the past and rethinking how silly what you said was, et cetera, et cetera.

So, to break out of that kind of spiraling of thought, and to be more self-compassionate, it really takes a lot of awareness. Because we're moving so quickly that sometimes we're not even aware of the litany or barrage of critiques that are just flying through our heads. So, step one is to become aware of that and don't further shame yourself. Say, “Hey, I shouldn't speak to myself like that.” It’s a challenge to become aware of that, but it is truly step one.

After that, you can then ask, “How can I actually relate to myself in a different way?” Greg, as you know, I've just had a second baby, and I'm doing a bunch of reading on postpartum depression and all the anxiety that happens, because it’s a real thing. And whether it's postpartum depression or just regular life stress anxiety, people are struggling with the mental and emotional load they're carrying.

We have to learn to relate to ourselves in a kinder, more gentle way. Just think of how you hold and talk to a baby. It's all cuddles and coos, and you're so encouraging with every step they take or door knob they turn. So supportive. But, when it comes to how we treat ourselves, well, it's probably not on that same tangent. There's actually a mindfulness practice that they call grandmother's voice, where you talk to yourself the way your grandmother would speak to you, or a loved one.

Here is an example. Yesterday, for the first time in about a year and a half, I went to yoga – the kind of hot yoga where they have a mirror in the front of the class. And there was a quote on the door walking into the studio that says, "When you look in the mirror, what do you see?" And we were doing tree pose, or a variation of it, which is a balancing posture, and I kind of allowed my eyes to fuzz so I can see the outline of my body, or the silhouette, but not anything specific. And I just looked at the different shapes of light coming through until I could find balance with the way the light was moving through my body. I thought in my head, “Gosh, that looks great, that's so beautiful.” And that for me was such a reflection moment, because when I first started yoga, I don't know 15, 20 years ago, it was hard for me to look in the mirror, because I couldn't stop nitpicking the different aspects of my body. And whether you're a woman or a man, I think any time you look in the mirror, it's easy to be very critical.

Yoga can be a very natural place to try and practice some self-compassion. It’s 180 degrees to go from where you can't even look in the mirror because you're just hating on your body to a point where I’m just accepting my postpartum baby body as it is and appreciating the shape of it as light moves through. I mean, it was, for me, a real growth moment. 

GW: Having been to hot yoga and spent some time looking at the mirror, I fully relate to that. It's amazing how much this idea is coming up – relating to yourself in a different way through radical self-acceptance. This is now the third conversation I have had about this topic on my podcast. It seems to be a universal struggle.

EC: I think we absolutely need self-doubt, because evolutionary psychology would say it prevents habituation and helps produce drive. We don't want to be complacent. But I think we are living in a hyper over-driven society where when we stop, we don't know what we're doing anymore, because we are so tied to achievement and external markers of what success looks like. I think we've internalized this need to achieve and contribute and be great. These are all wonderful things obviously, but not to the point that when we stop, we feel empty, or don't know who we are, or feel like we're not enough. I think that's where it can be self-acceptance, self-compassion, self-love. I mean, package it however you like, but there is a very important relationship with self, an internal one that, by exploring, I think opens up a whole gateway of potential.

If you enjoyed this Q&A you can subscribe to The Dr. Greg Wells Podcast on iTunes here: https://itunes.apple.com/ca/podcast/the-dr-greg-wells-podcast/id1434948381?mt=2.