Facebook's Deb Liu on women in product: "We cannot take progress for granted."

Deb Liu started as a product manager at PayPal and then moved on to Facebook. If you’ve ever bought, sold, or even browsed on Facebook Marketplace, you already know her work. 

A few years ago, Deb noticed something: when she started out, her peers were both men and women. It seemed pretty much 50-50. A decade in, the women had mostly disappeared. Product management had become heavily male-dominated.

When it comes to equality at work, we want to think that things get better over time. That opportunity expands. But it doesn’t always work that way. In fact, sometimes if we’re not paying close attention, opportunity contracts. 

This is what happened for Silicon Valley product managers a decade ago. Deb set out to understand just how this happened. Then, she tried to do something about it. She shares this work in an article that I consider required reading for anyone who cares about equity in tech.

You can download the episode to hear about it, or listen to it below. Then, please, share your own thoughts and tag them #HelloMonday so I can jump into the conversation.

??Here are some highlights….

On what happened to women in product management: "We fell out of product market fit with our product management. Even though we had done the role, we were no longer invited to the party."

On what it happened: "I think each of us felt like we had done something wrong. But actually what happened was the industry changed and we didn't realize it."

On the impact of Google's hiring approach, with a strong focus on technical skills, on the industry: "It was a choice that made sense for one company and an industry at a time when things were changing a lot, but it had disproportionate impact over a long period of time."

On the impact of an industry shift to hire people with strong technical backgrounds: "Women were being pushed out of the field in a way that was unexpected. They eventually went on to other roles. So I went to a product marketing management role...And then the second thing that happened was new women did not enter the field."

On Facebook's efforts to bring more women back into product management: "We spent years unpacking small things and big things that made a difference. The CS degree was the one we identified early on. Dropping that requirement actually made a huge difference."

On the technical interview: "We still had a technical interview and a lot of women that I spoke to said the intimidation of just knowing someone's going to test you on a thing that you're not going to be prepared for discourage them from interviewing. And so we removed the technical interview altogether. The quality of our PM's did not go down. Actually we were able to draw from a bigger pool."

On what it takes to be a successful product manager: "The most important skill and a product manager is empathy—really understanding what problem you're trying to solve and solving it."

On how we maintain our progress: "I think we always believe that things are going to get easier and better over a long period of time, but then we have setbacks. This setback in product management is an example. In order to make progress, you have to monitor. You have to keep track of what's going on."

?? Office Hours: Taking your questions

How do we unlock more opportunity for more people in our organizations? This week on Office Hours, producer Sarah Storm and I will talk about what we've learned from Deb Liu and other Hello Monday guests on this topic.

If you haven't been to Office Hours, I encourage you to join us. It's our coffee break, quite literally--a time to get together with listeners for a little community. Sarah and I go live every Wednesday at 3pm EST to talk about the week's episode, get ideas for the future shows, and generally catch up. We've got a steady group of listeners who join us every week and quite a few people who pop in occasionally. Sometimes we invite guests; sometimes we keep it very informal. If you have an idea for a guest, or thoughts on startup life, or you just want to come see who puts the show together, RSVP below or email us for a link at [email protected].