Exceptional Female Role Models – Irmgard Naudin ten Cate

Irmgard Naudin ten Cate leads the Talent Attraction & Acquisition function across EMEIA (Europe, Middle East, India and Africa) at EY. She leads a team that makes approx. 45,000 hires per year.

She is also the Global Assurance Talent Acquisition Leader, in this role she leads Recruiting for the Audit, Financial Advisory, Forensics and Sustainability practices around the world.

In a 21 years career with EY, she has developed vast expertise in recruiting strategy; diversity, equity & inclusion; change leadership; talent intelligence; employee advocacy; and talent attraction at the executive, experienced and campus levels.

Irmgard is a passionate advocate for the EY Ripples program – where EY staff devote time to sustainable development goals in the local communities where they operate. By bringing together the combined skills, knowledge and experience of the EY global network they have a goal to impact 1billion lives by 2030.

This is achieved by: working with impact entrepreneurs around the world to scale innovative solutions to global problems; supporting the next generation to develop mindsets and skills to find and sustain meaningful work; accelerating environmental sustainability by driving adoption of business models that protect and regenerate the environment, while unlocking economic opportunity.

Can we start by understanding a little more about your personal background story?

I was born in Den Helder, The Netherlands into a military family – my Dad was in the Navy Marines until I was 8 years old. As a result of my dad’s work we moved location probably every 3 years, and I actually studied 3 years of my high school education near Seattle, USA.

I think regularly moving around - both at home in the Netherlands and going abroad - gave me my first taste of navigating change. I definitely had to develop the skill of being able to stand back and observe many different cultures and appreciate the expected do’s and don’ts of my new surroundings.

I studied International Law at Erasmus University in Rotterdam with the intention of becoming a Lawyer. I had supported myself through my university studies with a variety of jobs, including working at a law firm for 5 years; supporting a PhD researcher; and working for a radio station.

This work experience really helped me identify the things that I didn’t want to be doing for a career, and eventually it became clear to me that the training component of becoming a lawyer involving lots of library time probably wasn’t for me.

I think sometimes we are lucky and can quickly discover what we do want, but also I don’t think there is anything wrong with working backwards and crossing off your list the things you don’t want to be doing and then by a process of elimination discovering your strongest skills and what you really enjoy doing the most.

I identified that I enjoyed interacting with people, and particularly enjoyed understanding a problem and helping find a solution - but I still didn’t quite know how to apply that to a career.

One of my friends worked for a recruitment agency and she suggested that I start working with them as it would give me a broad view of what different companies did and hopefully that would help me figure out a career that I was drawn to.

It was super fun and super commercial, I learned a lot and I really enjoyed the engagement with my clients. I initially thought I would work in this job for around 6 months, but I ended up staying for almost 3 years until somebody at EY approached me and suggested I join them to provide a similar service, but in-house.

Back in 2003 internal talent acquisition functions weren’t really an established profession so I wasn’t sure, but as I went through the interview process everybody I spoke with at EY was really passionate and super engaged with the business, and it became obvious that the culture was something amazing and that the work would challenge me – something else I was looking for.

So here I am now! Many moons later and still enjoying a 20+ years journey that has presented me with many exciting opportunities and my current role focussed on hiring around 45,000 people every year across almost 100 countries in the EMEIA region.

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What are the most valuable skills you wish you had learned earlier in life?

Look for opportunities to let others shine.

When we begin our careers we are all very eager to show what we know, what we can personally do – the focus is on ourselves. As you move into leadership I have learned that thinking about your team and giving your colleagues an opportunity to develop and show their knowledge is really important.

I phrase this to myself as ‘just because you know the answer, are you sure that you are the person who should be giving it’? As I get more experienced as a leader, I try to find ways to include my team members in meetings rather than just me. I look for opportunities to show them my trust and confidence in them, and to give them the chance for their voices to be heard instead of mine.

If you plan ahead, you are ahead.

It sounds very basic, but think about the people you work with who are always prepared and contribute great ideas versus those people who always seem to be struggling to catch up and very quickly get swamped when anything unexpected arises.

I believe that time management and project management skills are incredibly valuable and really underrated.

If you aren’t currently a really organized person, then just start off with something that sounds boring, but is also very simple – don’t end your day today without putting together your plan for tomorrow.

Be very deliberate about identifying the skills you currently lack, and then be proactive about developing these.

Being intentional about getting to know yourself and working out what you are good at doing / what you really enjoy doing is very important.

Then once you have identified your development areas, search for mentors or for colleagues who are strong in these areas and ask for help.

My other suggestion is that you learn not to say No to different experiences. Developing adjacent skills is really valuable, and even if you can’t see how it directly benefits you today in the linear view you might have of your career, don’t narrow yourself too much – be curious, be open to change, be brave!

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What is the best advice you’ve been given or regularly give to others?

I had some great advice regarding a personal situation, this was ‘you are only ever as happy as your unhappiest child’. I also think you can adapt this for your working life – ‘you are only ever as good as your least motivated team member’.

I see this as a reminder to not spend a disproportionate amount of time working with only the superstars in your team. As a leader you need to be mindful of developing all your team members and working hard to figure out the best way forward with regards to your least motivated team members.

Believe in your own strengths and resist the temptation to constantly compare yourself to others.

I really hope that people find out what is special about themselves. I truly believe that we all have unique and special aspects to our style, personalities and capabilities; but I think sometimes we lack the confidence to dig deep within ourselves and search to discover ‘what is so special about me’?

Try to remember that nobody is a person that everybody loves. What is most important is to be the kind of person that you love, and strive to be the best version of yourself, so you can look in the mirror and be happy with who you are.

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What are the biggest life lessons you have learned?

Have the courage to lead.

When you see something that is not good or you spot people doing things that are inappropriate, don’t pretend you didn’t see it – have the courage to step in, or at least determine an effective strategy for how you will address the situation later.

One of my personal values is to stand up and take action whenever I sense injustice. I feel it is important that we each live our core values – to me, values are not just something written on a website or a slogan. I’m a calm and happy person, but if I see values being ignored I will always step in and speak up. Don’t allow situations or comments that go against your values to go unchallenged.

Be humble enough to learn from all people around you – especially by listening to different generations.

It’s quite easy to assume that the way you personally approach your work or career is the right way and that others with a different view must be wrong. But younger generations who are equally as excited and passionate about challenging purposeful work but might want more freedom or flexibility are not necessarily wrong…in fact they may well have it completely right, and all of us who were brought up working 10 hours per day 5 days per week in the office perhaps were wrong?! Let's listen to each other more, and with an open mind.

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What is your advice for younger people starting out in their careers overcoming their mistakes or challenges?

Firstly, I really hope that you work in a culture of trust where, within your working environment, it’s okay to make mistakes without fear.

Honesty is really important, as is communicating to others quickly. Identify somebody that you can go to and discuss what has happened ASAP – this might be a trusted colleague or peer or manager, but start talking to somebody and get their advice.

Be able to scenario plan – what should have happened vs what has happened – and have an open and transparent discussion.

Finally, make sure to learn the lessons from every mistake so that the same mistake isn’t made again in the future. This might even be a teaching moment for the whole team to get better. What can we do differently to build a process to better protect us against making the mistake in the first place?

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What are your thoughts about the importance of protecting our mental health and wellbeing?

In some ways my upbringing hinders me, because I was raised in an environment that was more focused on the importance of picking yourself up and moving forwards irrespective of what life throws at you.

As a leader what I think about is that I work with many different individuals from really varied backgrounds, so I need to be thoughtful about how well each of them is doing. We truly have no idea about what might be going in people’s personal lives that could be impacting them, so I try to ask more questions and show empathy through a genuine interest in each of their lives.

I’ve personally always loved to do sports and go to the gym. I am very open about pointing out that my diary is blocked between certain times every Monday, Wednesday and Friday mornings for my gym sessions. I want to share this and help my team realise that being intentional about finding space to invest in the activities that bring you balance and allow you to refuel is okay.

For another person it might not be the gym, it might be going on a walk in the outdoors or finding the peace to read a book. So as a team I encourage that we talk openly about wellbeing, and also that everybody is aware of the various tools that are available if they feel like they are struggling.

Each team will have a different dynamic as to the best way for them to explore the topic of wellbeing – for some it might be open discussion, for others a WhatsApp group or Snap and seeing what we are each doing in our personal lives, but ultimately I want to role model good healthy behaviour, that I spend quality time with my husband and three kids and let people know I am there for them, and should they ever need me I am there to listen.

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How important have role models and mentors being in your journey?

I would say there have been 3 people that have made a profound impact on me – and not to say that others haven’t given me great support too, but these particular individuals have really helped my journey.

The first is actually a retired partner at EY – when I was around 28 years old he actually approached me and asked ‘what are you doing here?’…at the time I was a HRBP and feeling like I was delivering my role as a true professional, so I asked him what he meant.

He said that knowing my capabilities he thought I was capable of doing more but instead had accepted the status quo…he quite deliberately phrased this as ‘why don’t you stretch yourself anymore?’…my first reaction was that he was being quite rude!...but then his comments made me take action on some ideas I had been thinking about for ages but done nothing with. He kick-started my career advancement and helped me to stop making excuses and get back to challenging myself to be the best version of me that I possibly could be.

The next person was our former Global Recruiting Leader. She was absolutely instrumental in educating me on the importance as a leader of understanding the analytics and data of your business area.

She congratulated me on being empathetic, having strong vision, being a good speaker, having a team where people enjoyed working for me but also would point out that there are always development areas…”do you know your analytics?...do you know your data?”

She was absolutely right, I had a blind spot and she helped me educate myself and add a really important additional skill to my toolkit.

Then finally, EY’s current Global Recruiting Leader has also had a great impact on me. His leadership style is so well-rounded, and he encourages me to be open and share as transparently as possible with my team.

We talk about creating a safe working environment and wellbeing. I’ve learned that it is essential to realise that just because we aren’t personally having an issue with something doesn’t mean that isn’t an area where others might be really struggling. So being a leader who goes out of their way to make others feel they can come to you and talk about anything is very important.

Mentors are fantastic and I definitely encourage you to reach out directly to ask people if they have the capacity to support you in areas you have identified where you need development. Always be clear on what your ask is - do you need a one-off chat or are you hoping for a regular commitment - be brave and make connections.

Also if there is an obvious mutual connection that could broker the introduction for you then use that relationship to help you make the initial approach.

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What causes are you particularly passionate about at present?

I have a happy life which I feel very fortunate for, but I also feel that almost makes me obligated to give back wherever I can. I’m a really passionate advocate for the EY Ripples program – where EY staff devote time to sustainable development goals in the local communities where they operate. By bringing together the combined skills, knowledge and experience of the EY global network we have a goal to impact 1billion+ lives by 2030.

I definitely believe in each of us trying to focus on making our own space around us just a little bit better.

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Final question, what tips can you give people who might want to work for EY?...what are 2-3 things you look for when recruiting?

I would emphasise the skills we hope to see in candidates that are above and beyond their technical skills – because we can assume that candidates will be qualified to do the job they are applying for.

The 3 things I’m searching for are:

Curiosity – and most importantly coming prepared with examples that demonstrate how you have curiosity in your current/previous roles. Where have you not accepted the status quo? Where have you tried to improve or innovate?

Change mindset – how do you deal with constant change?...again prepare some examples that show how you embrace change as an opportunity to develop and learn.

Is this authentically a good fit for you?...don’t just try to please the interviewer! Check if the interview feels natural and a good culture fit for you, does it flow as a discussion and make you really want to work with us. If it does, EY might be for you! :)