Episode 177: Moving to “People Ops as a Product”: Matt Bradburn (Founder, The People Collective)
Listen to our recent episode with Matt Bradburn, Founder of The People Collective.
We talked about why the People Ops as a Product movement is picking up steam, how to pilot this approach, and the biggest pitfalls when making the change.
Read the highlights below. ??
1. The biggest hurdle to People Teams operating more like a product team ??
Matt believes that the biggest hurdle in transitioning to 'People Ops as a Product' is that it requires a complete mental shift in how we develop and implement HR programs. This approach requires a focus on specific business problems.
He compared running a company to managing a subscription model, emphasizing the need to create an organization that people consistently want to engage with. "How do we create an organization that people want to keep subscribing to?" he pondered, noting that 60 percent of a company's expenses are related to headcount.
Matt explained that the real challenge is not hesitation but understanding how to pragmatically apply 'People Ops as a Product.' "It's about the small steps you take tomorrow, not a complete reorganization of your team," he advised, emphasizing the importance of incremental change.
Ultimately, Matt advocates for a more targeted, problem-solving approach to HR that adapts over time, instead of broad, sweeping changes that may not align with the company's evolving needs.
2. Where to start with 'People Ops as a Product' ??
Curious where to start with People Ops as a Product?
Matt has seen many approaches.
He said, "It depends on the maturity of the business. Sometimes they come to us knowing they have a problem because of feedback from their engagement surveys or pressure from the top. Then, we work on a hypothesis, test it across the organization, and if early feedback is positive, we'll build an early stage version of the solution."
But it's not always straightforward.
Matt said, "Sometimes a company might say they want a better org design. But what they really mean is they want clearer compensation strategies and a better understanding of promotion processes. It’s not just about org design—it’s about transparency in compensation and reward structures."
He likened the process to troubleshooting a car: "Like opening up the car hood and really looking into it. If there's a rattle, is it the radiator fan or something else? We dig deep to find the true problem and then devise the simplest solution.”
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3. HR leaders who thrive in a ‘People Ops as a Product’ world ??
Here are the "3 traits of the CPOs who do 'People Ops as a Product' best," according to Matt:
1?? They use data and stories:
They skillfully use data alongside storytelling to make compelling arguments in the boardroom. They prepare by understanding the business metrics that matter and by engaging with key executives to align on strategy.
2?? They network extensively within the business:
These leaders have a deep understanding of the business. Their ability to network extensively allows them to grasp the inner workings of the business thoroughly, from product development to marketing dynamics.
3?? They’re empathetic, but don’t let it become debilitating:
Matt highlighted that the best CPOs possess a strong sense of empathy but also know precisely when and how to apply it. They make tough decisions without becoming overwhelmed by the emotional weight, focusing on both the people and the business’s future needs.
The HR problem Matt would fix with a magic wand ??
"I would pick two. One, we'd have the perfect way of doing performance management that we've all been waiting for. Like, let's just fix that. Number two, I would make Pave, Figures, and Radford all combine into one gigantic monopoly so that I could just get all the pay data I wanted and have the best resource of pay data available to me."
The career advice Matt would give to his 22-year-old self ??
"I would tell myself to be kinder to myself and to not put as much pressure on myself to be everything to every person all of the time. I also could have slowed down and taken a step back before making some big decisions."
See you next week!
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