Ask An Artist: Liz Fosslien

Liz is an award-winning illustrator, author, and design leader. Her work has been featured in TED, NPR, The New York Times and more, and she is on a mission to make work better. Welcome Liz, to Ask An Artist!

What got you interested in illustration, and how long have you been in that space?

So I definitely feel kind of like an imposter illustrator because I didn't study art. I don't have a design background. I studied economics and math, and my parents are also immigrants and always, really encouraged me to, get a quantitative degree, get a stable career path that had very clear milestones.

I've always loved more creative stuff. It just never entered my consciousness as a career until I was 23 - I was working as a consultant. Really hated it, it was long hours, it was absolutely not creative, but it was this job that checked all the like traditional success boxes.

It was like in a tall building. I put on a suit from Banana Republic, you know, did all the things - I felt successful. And I also was having horrible migraines and I was just miserable. So I basically burnt out of that job completely and then had to figure out what I was doing with my life. And I needed health insurance, and I had read somewhere that if you work part-time at Starbucks, you could get full benefits. And also, as a consultant, I had been going just as an escape, to the Starbucks down the street in Chicago, like three times a day, because I just wanted to get out of the office. And so the day I quit, I walked into that Starbucks and was like, "can I be a barista?"

So I worked there for about, seven months, and ( retail is really hard, this is not meant to glamorize it, so please be really nice to your baristas) I learned the power of intentional design through Starbucks. They've created this amazingly emotional brand loyalty and the coffee. I really like it, but it's, it's not the greatest coffee on the planet, but to me, that experience was this window into design, and leaning into emotions is a career path.

So that was, the first time in my life where I was like, "oh, maybe I should figure out what I can do, that's more creative" - and that's when I started doodling more seriously, and trying to learn Adobe Illustrator, and put more work out there - and that was 10 years ago now.

I think your work is so special because it hits on such an interesting topic, which is the intersection of work and emotion. What drew you to create art about those topics/issues?

It was this experience of just totally burning out of a job that I had wanted, that I had worked really hard to get that I thought was the start of a successful career, and looking back, I think there's a lot of stuff that I could have done (to make it better) for example, it never occurred to me that I could go to my manager and say, "Hey, these are aspects of my job that like, and these are aspects that I don't really like as much"- and I think I got this from my parents, this belief that to be a professional. You just don't question anything. You don't fail, you don't fuss and you absolutely do not feel. So you're like emotions over here and rationality and success and professionalism over here.?

And (in contrast) the Starbucks experience was all about emotion. So, for me, art especially the kind of the art that I do, which is like charts is a way for me to put out what I'm feeling at work, in a way that feels natural to me. In a sense, I still feel protected because I'm not sharing, you know, "Today. I felt like this". It's more like, here's a big picture thing of how I'm feeling that hopefully a lot of people can relate to.

I think you are in such a unique position, as someone who is both an artist, and someone who hires artists - now as the Head of Content at Humu ?- What does your role look like at Humu, and what got you interested in working there?

So the work that we do, is kind of a mix of content marketing. And one of the ways we do that is through our nudges. Humu sends nudges to employees and managers containing personalized suggestions of a small action. They can take that cause a really big impact on how people feel. So very simple example is when you first have someone joining your team, Just take the time to learn how to pronounce and correctly spell their name.

It's a huge thing. If you don't know how to say someone's name, then it just becomes a thing where you avoid calling on them or addressing them by their name. Cause you don't want to go through that uncomfortable moment. So stuff like that, where it's seemingly small, but it actually has a huge impact again on how people feel. So with those (nudges), it's a lot of writing and illustrations, and I hire artists to bring them to life.

?I originally came to the company. I was working on no hard feelings. It's just the first book I wrote with Molly, my friend, and I was interviewing a bunch of executives on emotions at work. And I interviewed Laszlo Bock. Who's the CEO of the company and just found that. A lot of executives would say things that are directionally really good, like be vulnerable, be your best self at work, be your whole self. But to me, I was always just like, what does that mean on Tuesday morning at 9:00 AM?

I don't know what it means, but like, what if I'm the only woman on my team? What if I don't feel safe? I'm not just going to spill my guts in this meeting. If there's no safe space for it. And he really addressed that nuance in this. That was really inspiring, and I hadn't really seen other people do that. And so the work that he was doing at HUMU, was just so in line with the research I had been doing. And so then I ended up working there.

Ah, I love when those synergies happen! You mentioned you hire artists often, how have you navigated that as an artist yourself?

I really try to trust their instincts - and I always ask at the start, when I've hired someone. What makes work fun for you? Because I really believe that people are going to do their best work when they're enjoying it. When I'm giving them projects that are really exciting to them.

And then also talking through, especially for creative people, how they like to work. So it's getting an understanding of when do you like to work? How do you like to get feedback? I could record myself talking through feedback. I can leave comments on a document, just so that we're on the same page, I really want to set them up for success. And so I'd really encourage, people, especially if they're not creatives to kind of, get a little more flexible in how you interact with people. And then again, really trust their (the creatives) skillset.

And then the last thing I would say is I've also learned to give - (And maybe this is from being on the other side of it, where I'm more of the artist) - as specific of feedback as possible and explain the why. The most frustrating piece of feedback is like "make it more fun" - ?I don't know what that means. Like what does fun look like to you? So trying to be more detailed, like "this color isn't vibrant enough" or "it doesn't totally match our brand" - and going that one level deeper as opposed to these high-level things where it's really hard for them to figure out what they should be doing.

One of the issues that is plaguing artists and creators today, is this concept of working for exposure, or rather for free. Have you ever been asked to work for exposure?

All the time. It's actually not just businesses. It's often friends too, and it's well-intentioned, you know, they're like, oh, this is so cool, could you put this together for like my birthday party invitation or something? And, I would say on the corporate side, when a big brand reaches out to you, it is really tempting to just do it for the exposure and the publicity.

And I think there's a whole debate to be had of like, maybe sometimes it's worth it, but what I've really tried to remind myself - it's not just about me. If I do this for free, I'm setting the standard for every single creator out there that this is going right. And I think that's really bad. So keeping in mind too, that part of supporting other artists in a community is to charge a decent rate and to make that the expectation for them.

How have you sidestepped or navigated those for exposure opportunities?

I'll just say, "Hey, this is a really exciting project, I have a lot on my plate. Here's my going rate" and then that's just waiting to see what they say. I've also learned from a friend too. If someone asks for something, just kind of set the expectation, that obviously I'm going to be paid. So saying something like, " I'd love to set up a time to talk about this more this and then I can also give you my rates...etc" It's just really important to not apologize. To not feel bad for asking for payment. Your time is valuable. Your skillset is valuable.

On the flip side, what advice would you share with folks on the other side of the table, who are hiring artists and creators about how they can better work with these folks?

I think it's understanding, that it is a job. And reminding yourself that because they're freelance, they have to ( in the U.S.) cover their own health insurance, cover their own cost of materials, and so really keeping in mind that it's like dealing with any (non-creative) contractor. They are running a business and you should try to support that. The biggest piece of advice is just to treat them like any other expert consultant that you would bring in,

Are there any artist myths you would like to debunk?

I would say the one that I actually believe for a long time was that artists have a huge studio and they stay up till 5:00 AM and it's just like lightning rods and inspiration hitting them all the time and they're just creating. But most of the (artists I know) have really strict routines. And so it's less about like, when I feel motivated, I'll create. And it's more about actually carving out the time and putting a lot of structure in place. So weekend mornings when I drink coffee, that's when I create and every weekend I do it, and it's kind of like a meditative process for me.

What advice would you give to someone who is maybe is having trouble deciding whether or not to pursue art as their career?

I wish that more people got this message earlier on that, it's not like here's a professional career, and here's art and you have to pick one of the other. There's a lot of interesting stuff going on in the middle where you can be very successful, make yourself money, make a company, a lot of money and it's a really sustainable career path.

Check out more of Liz's work at?fosslien.com?or follow her along on Twitter at @fosslien or Instagram at @lizandmollie