Why Effort-Based Metrics Are More Important Than You Think

Jason Sacks is EVP-Business Development & Philanthropy at Positive Coaching Alliance, a non-profit organization dedicated to creating positive youth sports culture. In this interview, Sacks explains why data is becoming more important for sales organizations, why “effort-based” metrics may be more important than you think, and what he learned working at the Jersey Shore.   

We asked Jason 23 questions. Here are his 23 answers. 

1. What did you have for breakfast this morning?

Breakfast smoothie. This has been the routine since Covid started, and I’m now home every day. 

2. What’s the last great thing you binge-watched?

My wife and I just finished “Queen’s Gambit.” I thought it was amazing. I also relived my childhood (and current) love for “Karate Kid” and binged “Cobra Kai” on my own.

3. How has COVID-19 affected how you/your sales org operates and in your adoption of virtual selling practices? How are you handling more remote salespeople?

Positive Coaching Alliance has always relied on remote management of salespeople, but Covid has also forced the salespeople themselves to rely more on remote selling. Much of PCA’s success comes from selling to orgs that use group decision-making. Because we’re less able to physically present at a group meeting, this reality has put a greater emphasis on consensus selling — the ability to create advocates within these orgs. We also have done numerous coaching sessions on the best practices of using video, such as Zoom, for meetings. 

4. Which among these changes from COVID-19 will continue in the years after the pandemic subsides?

We will continue to use the strategies that we’ve implemented to be more efficient with our sales process (i.e., initial outreach methods). Because we’ve expanded the geographic reach of our salespeople, the use of virtual selling will continue to be a requirement to being successful. It has also expanded our product line that now includes virtual training, which will allow us to sell to organizations that would have been difficult to reach in the past. Prior to the pandemic, we went back and forth on how effective we could be selling remotely or virtually. Since everyone has had to adjust to the video-meeting lifestyle, it’s made the transition a little easier.

5. What does the term “buyer first” mean to you, and is a buyer first approach operationalized in your sales org? 

To me, “buyer first” implies a consultative selling approach that puts the needs of the buyer first.  As a mission-driven non-profit with specific Key Impact Measures, PCA does have a specific goal when selling to an organization. Moreover, many of the organizations that we interact with do not necessarily know that the problems they face are being driven by challenges that PCA can solve. That is why we utilize many of the elements of the Challenger Sales method in our approach. That said, our ultimate goal is to assist our Partners in becoming the positive, character-building organizations that they envision, and listening to their challenges and needs (before and during their partnership experiences) is a way to make that happen.

7. How do you go about building trust with prospects?

Listening. Listening to their challenges/needs, while also providing insight into what we’ve learned. It’s about being experts in our field. We also strive to provide the best experience possible for our Partners. One of the pillars of the “PCA Way” is going the extra mile for our partners. This helps in building trust, knowing that we have their best interests in mind at all times.

 8. How should sales orgs prioritize diversity in their hiring and their operations?

Prioritizing diversity is so important and we want our sales team (and really our entire staff) to mirror the partners we work with in the communities we work in. We know this is an area that we need to get better in, and it starts with how we recruit for open positions — where we are posting our jobs, what proactive outreach and sourcing we are doing. Having a diverse team not only helps better connect with our partners and prospects but also makes our team internally better. Learning from others' experiences and different perspectives helps develop a more well-rounded organization.

9. What jobs did you have in high school and what lessons did you learn from them that you still put into practice today?

I grew up in southern New Jersey, near the beach. I spent summers working in the restaurant industry (shoutout to Steve and Cookies in Margate, New Jersey) and would recommend that everyone does that at some point. Whether it was being a server, working behind the bar shucking oysters or working as an expediter in the kitchen, there are so many lessons learned from working in the restaurant industry — not only external facing with customers (starting conversations, building relationships, listening), but also how many different parts of the restaurant internally need to be on the same page, working together to provide the best possible experience. Lots of different personalities to manage as well!

10. Since you started in sales and business development, what’s the biggest change you’ve witnessed? How have you (and your team) adapted to this change?

The use of technology, specifically CRM and email outreach. We’ve strived to become a more efficient sales organization, while also not forgetting that the “old-fashioned” tools, like the phone, are still extremely necessary for success.

11. What’s your assessment of how Sales Ops has become more crucial for sales orgs? What’s the story of that shift — why is it happening? How is it being done well (or not)? 

Given all of the technological tools at our fingertips, the development of Sales Ops has become so much more valuable to ensure that you’re the most efficient sales organization you can be. That said, it’s a position that is not realistic for many companies/organizations with smaller sales teams. 

12. How important is diversity in your sales org and why? 

It’s very important because it allows us to learn from different experiences. Given that we’re selling to youth sports organizations across the country that are in very different socio-economic circumstances, having these insights allows us to improve as a sales team, and as an organization as a whole. 

13. How do you use data in your sales org? 

We use data to help manage the salespeople. This allows us to help identify struggling salespeople and assist all with getting better at their craft. We are obviously tracking results, quotas hit, etc., but PCA wants to practice what we preach — so we put a lot of focus on effort goals, and metrics around effort-based activity. That piece helps to identify issues/challenges and evaluate our salespeople as well. We also use data to be more efficient with our sales process, especially the initial stage(s). What type of outreach is most effective, and that could differ whether we are reaching out to a high school athletic director or a Little League board president. 

14. What are the key metrics for measuring the success of individual salespeople and the entire sales org and how have these changed over the years, if at all?

 We’re using close rates at each of the five stages of our sales process, as well as renewal metrics. We’re also using Partner buy-in metrics: average $/sale, multi-year commitment, mandating of our training.

15. How do you use LinkedIn and LinkedIn Sales Navigator for your job? 

LinkedIn and Sales Navigator has been such an important part of PCA’s growth — specifically when it comes to recruiting Board Members, Leadership Council Members and other volunteers to get more involved with PCA across the country. We’ve had several donors and board members say, “I’m not sure how you found me, but I’m so glad you did — I love being a part of the PCA movement.” We found them on LinkedIn. We often will search and look for individuals that mention their youth sports coaching experience or their experience as a college student-athlete. So many people are involved with youth/high school sports, and the PCA message really resonates with them. LinkedIn has helped us find those individuals that want to get more involved.

16. What’s something that’s not on your LinkedIn profile?

My wife and I are the proud parents of 5-year old boy, girl twins. The last 10 months of quarantining have been quite the experience — but we are lucky that they have each other to keep themselves busy, and all of us relatively sane. 

17. What’s the best sale you’ve ever made?

I am really proud of the partnerships PCA has created with professional sports leagues like the NBA and MLB. For them to recognize the importance of a positive youth sports experience, and to invest in PCA to help them achieve that is really cool to see. I am also proud of our partnership sales team that has been able to develop partnerships with seven of the top 10 largest school districts in the country. Those partnerships are so impactful.

18. Are great salespeople made or born?

Yes. At PCA, we are big believers in Carol Dweck’s theory of Growth Mindset (highly recommend the book Mindset). Focusing on how you can improve and get better, and that everyone has the ability to get better is an important way to look at things. In our workshops, we discuss how some great basketball players are sometimes referred to as “natural shooters”...but in essence, do you know how many hours that individual put in to become a great shooter? When it comes to sales, I think anyone that has the interest in becoming a good salesperson, has the ability to do so. 

19. What song is on repeat for you right now?

 More podcasts as of late - LeBatard Show, The Daily, ESPN Daily, Pod Save America, The Ringer podcasts - as well as any other random episodes people send along!

20. What are the key talents you look for when hiring salespeople?

Some of the key talents we look for when hiring salespeople include good communication skills- written and verbal; being an effective storyteller; organized; hard-worker; someone that is passionate about the PCA mission (while also making sure they want to be a salesperson, and not just work at PCA because of the mission). 

21. How do you work with marketing and how would you like to see that relationship changed?

We are always looking for ways that we can improve the sales and marketing relationship. Over the last few years, we’ve really improved our tracking of how marketing is driving sales leads (and we know we still can be better here). A challenge we face is having the resources/bandwidth to make sure all of our databases (marketing, development, sales) are integrated to talk to each other and communicate with our constituents in an efficient and meaningful way. PCA has many different audiences (youth sports organizations, schools, individual coaches, parents, donors, etc) so tailoring the right marketing/communication to each group is something we are continuing to work on.

22. What behaviors from sales teams do you think drive buyers crazy?

Being too pushy, while not providing insight; not following through on promises; making the sales/partnership process too complicated.

23. What’s a question that didn’t I ask but should have? 

How can someone learn more or get involved with PCA? Visit us at positivecoach.org or reach out directly to me on LinkedIn. We are always looking to partner with schools and youth sports organizations, as well as finding individuals that personally want to get more engaged with PCA.